I do still think that Jim Ferry isn't the answer but I do believe the larger problem is the lack of commitment from the university heads, 

Hopefully the new administration realizes this. 

I asked in another post about the recruiting budget compared to others in the A-10.  That question got sidetracked.  Then their was a story in the PG about Pitt boosters, the cash they put up, the private jet they make available for recruiting.  While a private jet seems out of DU's range (covered wagon?) , I do wonder about that budget as opposed to our league competition.  Any numbers?   

Some thoughts on the question of whether our failure as a basketball program is the result of inadequate institutional support, deficiencies in coaching, a black cloud or a combination of all of the above.

You may recall that when Ron was fired, the AD had difficulty finding a coach and ultimately settled on, let's say, his third or fourth option. That tells us that the institution is not viewed favorably by the coaching community. When coach Ferry was hired, he made sure that his salary was significantly higher than what was paid to Ron and that he had a long term commitment from the school. Even then, he was reported to have asked if anyone could win here. So I think the fundamental issue is school support. And I don't think that support necessarily has to do with the recruiting budget, but has more to do with the facilities. Pittsburgh is a good place to recruit to, but our facilities simply don't cut it. Sprucing up the locker room doesn't cut it. The school has not done enough. Look at the facilities of the teams in our conference. Why come here?

That said, coach Ferry could have done better with the teams that he had in place, particularly on defense. So some of the blame for the recent years lies with him. As an example, St. Bonaventure does not have great facilities, is located in an outpost for the Army Calvary and does not have the same budget as us, but out-performs us. Coaching plays a role there. However, St. Bona is an exception in that it over achieves expectations. Most schools don't. 

We have a disinterested student body because there is no enjoyment in coming to the games. We have a disinterested alumni base for the same reason. This last year I did not renew my season tickets after more than 30 years. I did so because I sometimes left Palumbo angry. There was no joy in Mudville. The school needs to take a good hard look at itself and determine if it wants to have a good basketball program. It appears that Mr. Harper is undertaking that analysis. It's up to them to decide what we are to be and go after it wholeheartedly.   

I know the stats guys can provide numbers but just to answer the question about the recruiting budget, my recollection is that it is about the middle of the pack in the A-10; so not really an albatross around the neck of the coaches., but not ideal when trying to crawl out of a hole.
I did point out a long time ago in this board, that when your program has been a bottom feeder in the A-10 (except a few times under Ron), you really need to spend above the league average at least until you right the ship and gain some credibility.  Once you reach the upper 25% of the league, your revenue should more than cover the additional spending on recruiting and other program needs.

levon1975 wrote:

I know the stats guys can provide numbers but just to answer the question about the recruiting budget, my recollection is that it is about the middle of the pack in the A-10; so not really an albatross around the neck of the coaches., but not ideal when trying to crawl out of a hole.
I did point out a long time ago in this board, that when your program has been a bottom feeder in the A-10 (except a few times under Ron), you really need to spend above the league average at least until you right the ship and gain some credibility.  Once you reach the upper 25% of the league, your revenue should more than cover the additional spending on recruiting and other program needs.

Former SID Sue Ryan told me back in the mid-90s that, at that time, our basketball budget was about fifth or sixth  in in the A-10, which at that time included schools like West Virginia, Rutgers and Temple.  Say what you will, but we never were a miserly program in terms of the total dollars spent. Now, where they were spent, that appears to be an equine of a separate hue.
 

I don't buy into the theory that our facilities hold us back.  Bona doesn't have a great arena either and they are competitive most years. LaSalle doesn't have a great venue and they made a deep run in the NCAAs two years back.  Martelli coaches out of a tiny arena and makes the tournament every few years.  And Fordham plays in something like a high school gym and was better than us this year.  Our best teams 40 years ago practiced in what looked like a cave built into the side of a mountain and played across the street in the Civic Arena. The Palumbo isn't state of the art, but other teams in this league would be happy with it.  And Duquesne can move games to the Consol whenever they can attract more than 4000 fans.  Its coaching that matters.   

ElDuque wrote:

We don't have great facilities. Better than nothing, is probably the best way to describe. They affect us, because it's where kids play. The atmosphere is the worst part. We do not have a home court advantage.

Harper told me directly,  "We actually have a home court DIS-advantage!"
 

Maybe the bar is being set very low. Wow Mac schools hey this is the A-10. EXCUSES EXCUSES...Just win !

Mulder I'm not sure if you include me in this category since I've been critical of Ferry. I'm not in the camp that he should be fired, so I wouldn't speculate on a potential replacement in any form. I'd consider changing my mind if Coach K wanted to coach Dukes instead of Duke, but I honestly think it would have been a mistake to fire him after a 17 win season. That's sorta where most folks had this team pegged, even if it took 34 games to get there. I predicted 10 wins, so Ferry exceeded my expectations.

What I'd rather see is Ferry adjust to the A-10. Specifically:
1. You have to play defense. Period. And you need players who can do that (taller guards, mobile bigs). A-10 quality kids are out there. Ferry, for example, never recruited over Derrick Colter and really only went after one suitable backup (Ridenour). He paid the price for it. Might get away with it at a lower level conference, but the A-10 has excellent PGs.
2. You have to eliminate the "cross midcourt and shoot" and "dribble aimlessly until you can take a bad shot" offensive "schemes." We don't move well with or without the ball, we don't pass well, we don't set good screens, we don't get guys open for layups in halfcourt play. I'm not sure I saw so much as a bounce pass this year to a cutter. Once Powell walked out, we seemed to lose our inside game altogether. Might get away with this stuff at LIU, but as LaSalle proved against us in the A-10 tournament, the programs in our conference are well-coached.
3. You have to coach you kids to handle pressure better. Geez, walk "down the hall" and watch the WBB practice. I was surprised teams didn't double or pressure our guards more because both DC and Micah were turnover machines at the first sign of being pressed. Maybe you expect a lower level conference team to have the yips, but it doesn't get you far in the A-10.
4. You can't play 2-3 guys nearly 40 minutes a night and expect them to have fresh legs down the stretch. It's no way to build a program. It cost us a couple games this year, and going into next year it might have actually been a benefit that Jeremiah was injured because otherwise James would have been limited to a couple of minutes and Jackson and Steele would have been picking splinters out of their bums all year. Then you'd have Lewis, Gill and a bunch of unknowns coming back. Ferry had eight non-winning seasons at LIU before striking gold. Is that his idea of building?

Ferry's been around the game long enough to have picked something up. His staff has been together four years. Maybe he should pick an offensive coordinator and a defensive coordinator and let them help fix some of this. If he doesn't have that kind of skill on his staff, then maybe it's time for a few changes.

But do something different. Four non-winning seasons in a row here. No one wants to wait five more seasons to see it turn around.

And of course, starting over with a new five year plan is also not a desirable option. Just my opinion.

Mulder wrote:

No, ED - wasn't trying to single you - or anyone really - out on this.  And thanks for your reply because I agree with the points you raise and they are clear and to the point.  Certainly, I hope you are right - corrections can be made and set us on the right course without changing coaches because that would mean we have turned a corner.

Just to be clear to all - because maybe I'm not doing that and others think I'm calling them out for having an opinion - I don't mean these couple of posts on hiring a coach as a criticism of anyone whether you support Ferry or not, want to see him fired or not, etc.  And my questions are irrelevant if Ferry succeeds and brings DU up to a high level because then another coach will likely want to come here.  But if he fails, or if the powers that be perceive he is failing and we go through the process of hiring another coach I don't see how any coach will look at this as an attractive job.  So I'm asking these questions because many of you have an opinion and have more knowledge of basketball than me and because I'm legitimately curious  - why would anyone think this is an attractive job and would actively seek it or be willing to discuss it with the AD?
 

Travis Ford was just hired by St. Louis. Ford went from Campbell to Eastern Kentucky to UMass to Oklahoma State. So his career path was up - up - up - down. Our comparable coach at Duquesne would have been Nee who went from Nebraska to Bobby Mo to Duquesne. The difference is that Ford is only 47. Nee was 55 when we signed him. Ford probably wants to get another up. Nee was playing out the string. So there is one type of coach that might consider us, someone that was successful at a power conference or the Big East then let go with no prospects at the high major level. Another option would be a top assistant at a power conference school or the Big East. That would be your John Carroll type. The third option is the Edgar-Everhart low major successful coach looking to go up. For my two cents, if you put enough $ on the table, you can get a competent coach in any of those three scenarios. But, as ED has said, I have no stomach for another five year project. I do believe that the AD should force Ferry to bring in assistants that can overhaul the offense and teach defense though. Otherwise, the next two years will be painful. 
 

Hilltopper wrote:

Ferry is playing with fire in recruiting.  First, the mistake on Powell.  Second, Sanders, his jewel in the crown last class, did not sign here due to the Ferry charm; he signed because of promised play time at DU, which he could not get anywhere other than a low mid-major - thus JRob took the hit and got buried on the bench. Third, Littleson also signed with DU due to guarantee of playing time next year - how does that sit among James,Steele, Jackson and possibly Mike at the 3?   

How do you know all of this? There aren't many recruits  at any level of school that come out and say they don't expect to get some playing time right away. There's a big difference between telling a kid he WILL play right away versus he will have a CHANCE to play right away

KenOTR73 wrote:

Hilltopper wrote:

Ferry is playing with fire in recruiting.  First, the mistake on Powell.  Second, Sanders, his jewel in the crown last class, did not sign here due to the Ferry charm; he signed because of promised play time at DU, which he could not get anywhere other than a low mid-major - thus JRob took the hit and got buried on the bench. Third, Littleson also signed with DU due to guarantee of playing time next year - how does that sit among James,Steele, Jackson and possibly Mike at the 3?   

Well, if Ferry actually used a 10-man rotation, the playing time issue would resolve itself IMHO. I am disappointed in Sanders development at this point. Foul prone. No offense except put backs and slams. Defense up in the air to me. He did some nice things but the foul issue indicates that he is not getting positioning.
 

Ferry has a lot of faults, but not playing a 10 man rotation is really up there. Coaching at this level is beyond Ferrys abilities, forget all the BS of extended contracts, the Ron comparison, and the BS that admin needs to spend more to win. The fact that Ferry has shown no signs of out-coaching, out developing, out recruiting anyone in the A-10 for 4 years is a pretty good sign he is not the next level. Give him more time?? Get the same results..  And just because DU has a history of bad decisions to bring in bad coaches over and over does not explain why Ferry didn't win any game in four years that anyone can say, he out-coached or out smarted anyone. Ron did, not a Ron thing, just the only example that is relevant here.