Could having a true point guard make a big difference in the team? I just don't know how good Smith is. He is probably the key. Those who have seen him just rave about him. We haven't heard that since Soko sat out. He's from St. Anthony's, and ED always raved about how well Hurley prepared his point guards. To me, he is the key to everything. If he flops, we'll be hunting for a coach this time next year. If he's all he's cracked up to be, we may be eating some crow.

duq81 wrote:

Could having a true point guard make a big difference in the team? I just don't know how good Smith is. He is probably the key. Those who have seen him just rave about him. We haven't heard that since Soko sat out. He's from St. Anthony's, and ED always raved about how well Hurley prepared his point guards. To me, he is the key to everything. If he flops, we'll be hunting for a coach this time next year. If he's all he's cracked up to be, we may be eating some crow.

A True Point Guard like Ajax would have been a been a Big difference, and Micah and Derrick would have still scored all those points, but so would all the other players.  Derrick and Micah  would have been better set to score without the burden of setting up the offense, also, the last 3 plus minutes would not just fall apart.  Ajax could dribble out of traps, see the whole court, make his own space if he needed to shoot, and he made the assist first and took the shot only after the clock was running out. And no one defender took him out of the game, he was just too fast and had good size to shot over almost anyone guarding him.  Find that Point Guard next year that scores 8 to 12 points and 12 to 14 assists  with no turnovers, (and maybe a steal or two)  and you will have a winning team. Think that's too tall of an order? That's what it basically  takes to win.  Of course, you need guys like Lewis, James, and LG plus a shooting guard( to be names later), but it's all there, just no real " Floor General". Can't stand Ferry, but if he is somehow is here next year, find that player and even he can win.  

Last edited by NapaDuke (3/04/2016 12:20 am)

PhoenixRising2 wrote:

Napa, it is a tall order since there are only 25 players in the country averaging 6 or more assists per game. AJAX averaged 5.7 assists his senior year (setting a school record with the number of assists).

AJax had a 2 to 1 assist to turnover ratio on the horrible 3-24 team as a freshman. That was when I figured out that we had a keeper, and why I didn't like the idea of bringing in Kojo. I took Ron two seasons to realize what he had in Ajax, and to give him the ball. The result was fantastic.
Again, Smith is the key to next year, and beyond.
 

Your #8 is most descriptive explanation of what's wrong I've read along with Dome (7), as you pointed out.

Last edited by Hilltopper (3/04/2016 7:21 am)

duq81 wrote:

heelsdukesfan wrote:

just my random thoughts:
1. i don't know anything about powell behind the scenes. his demeanor reminded me of post broken wrist mel bolding--never seemed happy. probably thought he should be starting and getting the ball more. don't blame him for leaving. most likely would have been coming off the bench again next year. 
2. i don't think a true PG would have helped this year. he most likely would have brought ball down court, passed it to DC or Gill, who would have launched a 3 anyway. heck, ferry probably wouldn't even have played him anyway
3. i hope smith pans out, however, even if he is the real deal,  a lot will fall on his shoulders as i can't see gill or lewis stepping up that much on offense
4. powell was first to leave, though i doubt he will be only one. not sure if castro will bail. same with robinson. since they both already sat out a year. not sure how close they are to earning degree, but could see them taking advantage of the grad transfer rule
5. i can see the dukes getting 1 more win, most likely against lasalle in play in game
6. best thing that could happen to all of us is the dukes win a10 tourney; ferry could parlay that into another job, most likely closer to home(even if it is a lateral move), which would essentially make him and his family happy; harper and gormley could get their guy and make them happy; we would all rejoice by making the ncaa tourney and be very happy; either way, i think the cupboard is bare next year so we will be starting over anyway.
7. the dome has been saying all season- unforced turnovers, rushed offense, etc; no one listened to him when dukes where beating up on cupcakes, but it has really come to hurt team agains quality opponents. I'm thinking we should take this guy to vegas for tourney and let him bet for us. we could all walk away with a lot of cash…
8. good defense is more than just having a fg% against mark or "getting a hand in someones face". i think if we had some semblance of offense, where we worked the ball, used ball screens,make opponents work on the defensive end, it would also help to translate to better defense. (just like in football) we also make it way to easy for opposing players to get open. i see no denial of the ball, no rotation, etc. i don't think the defense has improved that much at all
9. i agree with Dome that we ought to go after an assistant from a big time program as our next coach. will b very difficult, and i dont think we would b able to land roy williams or tom izzos right hand man, but alot of these programs have former players who want to get into coaching as their 3/4 guys. one name that jumps out to me, and i may get struck by lightning, is jon scheyer from duke. he is like 5th in line to coach k. but he is young, played 4 years under one of greatest coaches(puke) and greatest programs(ugh, cant believe im saying this) and played some pro ball. knows what it takes to succeed. maybe not him, but someone along those lines...

 

Coach K's guys have a somewhat spotty record. Most are not horrible, but no one from his staff has really become a big time coach. Winning coaches come from all sorts of places, and there's really no pattern to it.

 81' I agree with most of your observations, and its true that when the offense worked well when our guys were patient and moved without the ball, but usually in crunch time it became very predictable and stagnant, resulting in Micah or DC either trying to create something with the ball, or taking a long 3 at the end of the shot clock.  I think we all have to consider that opposing coaches often make defensive adjustments that counteract the offense, so the things that worked in the first half don't work in the 2nd.
  
Ball screens blow up on you when the defense doesn't pay any attention to the screener, because the screener is no threat to score.  You saw what happens, then they just double the ball and trap (Dayton) and beyond.  I favor more motion away from the ball with screening away from the ball.  I also would love to see us run back door cuts more effectively when teams jump in the passing lanes. 
Finally, if I could add to your wish list, wouldn't it be nice to be able to take the opponent out of their offensive patterns by being more aggressive on defense, essentially using your defense to create offense and hopefully some easy scoring opportunities.  I always feel that the team that gets the most easy scoring chances will win the game, and you have to have some defensive options to create those chances on offense.  I don't care who you are, from Duke to Kentucky, there are times during a game, when your half-court offense bogs down.  That is when your defense should be able to help out by creating offense.  I understand we haven't had guys who can guard well enough, but hopefully some of the new guys can.
Also in reference to next year, I wouldn't be surprised if we don't see the freshmen getting a lot of playing time, if they can handle the transition to the college game.  It will be like starting over with some new toys in the arsenal.

Last edited by levon1975 (3/04/2016 11:53 am)

I do have a question though...
After watching Ferry coached teams for 4 years, what do you see that his team's do well?  Is there something that you could say is the mark of a Ferry coached team?

duq81 wrote:

PhoenixRising2 wrote:

I do have a question though...
After watching Ferry coached teams for 4 years, what do you see that his team's do well? Is there something that you could say is the mark of a Ferry coached team?

Kinda reminds me of the Scott Edgar days, which isn't saying much. In fact, over the last 40 years, can you think of any Dukes team that was known for being good at anything? Maybe Ron's teams that were known for gambling defense, and even that gave us mixed results. It was very effective against teams that were sloppy with the ball, but much less so against teams that took care of the rock. Otherwise, we're mostly known for losing.
 

yeah but go back and look at how Ron's teams excelled overall in defense and Ferry's teams were never defensive minded.  Ron's best team was ranked 41st nationally in that combined defense stat, Ferry has barely cracked 200 even with his best teams at LIU>

Speaking of that, can anyone find that post from last year that showed the comparison of the defensive teams and those statistics? It was very enlightening.
 

I am going to try and make this thought understandable, it is my observation looking back from my beginning in the early 1960's. Duquesne had been a regional power in the ancient days of the 1940's and 1950's in fact winning the National Championship NIT when eastern school players looked at the NCAA as we view the CBI. Teams voted on going to the 16 team tourney played in distant field houses but opted for NYC and the NIT.

Duquesne excelled due to great coaches and a network of folks tipping them off to the best black kids available, since many schools in the north didn't want them, the Fathers did and we got true All America players.

Red Manning played in that era and although not the best recruiter he got the best local talent in thanks to Mossie Murphy and his unofficial tie into the program, he loved Duquesne Basketball more than anyone who ever lived.

That great recruiting class with Lionel Billingy, Ed Searcy and two other guards whoI just no longer remember, ended in disaster when everyone but the Big Train left. Trains teams under Red went, 20-5, 16-8, and the other near 500%. During that time Asst Coach Cinacola spotted Norman Nixon, a little know guard that he saw playing top recruit Tree Rollins in Ga. In a championship game. Clemson got Rollins and Cinny came back with Slick under scholarship. The end had already started with Red recruiting W. Pa players who could shoot but were mostly slow players. During That time I was going to Arena games watching losses even though most home games had been homer wins, but that happened everywhere then.

Nixons four years were spent with average teams playing about 500% in record, I still recall reading the Basketball Bible, Street and Smith magazine in Norman senior year. It went like this in pre season predictions, Duquesne will go as far as Norman Nixion, their stellar guard, can finess them. He along with hard playing journeymen teammates won the Eastern Eight tournament and went to the NCAA with about a 500% record. Perry High's Ron Carter along with the VMI Keydets dispatched Duquesne in the first round.

From that point on Duquesne went from average to below average to some years awful, just like the teams we used to throttle and I felt sorry for as they lost by 25 plus to us. One of the teams was from Cincinatti with a funny name. Xavier

My point, Duquesne decline started in 1972 and has continued and continued, I always was a hopeful loyal fan, but in the midst of this abandonment of the program by school officials, I was unaware.

I doubt if we can return to 1968-1971 greatness ever again, too much has changed.

Phildog wrote:

I
I doubt if we can return to 1968-1971 greatness ever again, too much has changed.

Phil, I have said it before. We are never going to be a national power, like a Duke or Kentucky, BUT we have the resources and potential to be a Xavier or a Dayton, making the NIT almost every year, making the dance with regularity and even getting into a single digit seed once in a while.

That's it! That's our ceiling! But we can't even get within shouting distance of that goal, year after year, case in point this one, where after a 10-3 start, and at one point having 15 wins under our belt and 8 games over .500, we won't even make one of the garbage tournamants!

It's like that old saying about the "journey of a thousand miles." Watching the program fail to even take that first step year after year is just beating the enthusiasm out of me, and others on the board.
 

Heels I do believe many of our fouls can be traced to that factor. Since league play started I have been looking a lot more at the halftime box scores and that seems to be the trend.  One of Ferry's latest mantra's at his post game presser is that now that teams have scouted us we are getting shut down????  Is that a players fault?  Who does that reflect more poorly on?  Some of the coach speak that gets spewed out is incredible.
We all wondered how Powell's minutes would be divided and it didn't get much attention but when you get beat as badly as we did on the boards by a smaller team how can you justify marching out the same starting lineup. After 8 straight loses nothing changes.
Phoenix we generally come out a loser in the point differential at the foul line. When you consider our penchant for turning it over and the foul shot differential you could say we start every game at a 5-10 point deficit to overcome.

Last edited by The Dome (3/04/2016 2:53 pm)

The Dome wrote:

I would love to take a trip to Vegas for the tourney!!! Levon I would just like to flip the ball screen and pick & roll with you for a minute by asking what good is it if you never give up the ball???? Also what good is it if 30 games into the season the picker knows he isn't getting it and rolls the wrong way. Heels wow what a novel idea using offense also as a good defense. Every quick shot and every turnover results in YOU playing more defense. Great conversation!!!!

One last question and some of you have brought this up already, Smith may be the best point guard in years but who is he passing to. If we insist on staying with Lewis how many times does he not catch a perfect pass before you decide to stop. How will Gill learn how to move without the ball since all he's done is basically catch and shot.

Dome,  I think you are saying the same thing as I on the pick and roll, if we have no threat to score with the picker, then it becomes ineffective, when the defense realizes that they can just double the ball.  None of our "bigs" are a threat to do anything positive once the get the pass on the pick and roll.  I counted at least three times in the Fordham game that guys tried to hit Lewis basically unguarded under the basket and he whiffed on all three passes.  At times he is unprepared to receive the ball and other times he just flat out missed the pass!  That was my point, a pick and roll offense can't work that way.  You are just bringing more defense to your two scoring threats.  I'm sure as a guard you get the point where you hesitate to pass even to an open man, when there is little chance that he will catch the ball.  That is exactly why I responded that more pick and roll is not the answer for this team.

Like every other long-suffering fan, I have to say this has probably been the most disappointing season that I can recall — and I started following the Dukes when I was a young kid during the 68-69 season.  After our 10-3 and 15-7 start, who could have possibly imagined such a complete and utter collapse? 

The defeated and dispirited team that took the floor against Fordham a couple of nights ago doesn't even remotely resemble the team that played in the Gulf Coast Classic right before Thanksgiving — a squad that displayed crisp ball movement and some defensive tenacity...a team that could have been 6-0 if some of its 3-point shots had fallen in the first half of the Pepperdine game.  Trailing by 19 in that game, the Dukes showed some spirit in that outing, fighting back to pull within 7 points late in the second half.  They bounced back quickly and won the next two games in that tourney.

For a brief moment, I thought there might be something magical about this season.

Never would any of us have imagined at the time that this team might experience a collapse of this magnitude, possibly ending the season on a ten-game losing streak...  It didn't seem possible.

Barring some sort of miraculous drive for five in Brooklyn next week, I guess it's just the same old Duquesne, the doormat of the Atlantic Ten.  Thank you, Mr. Ferry.

  


  

Last edited by IronDukes12 (3/04/2016 10:20 pm)