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4/21/2021 11:28 am  #26


Re: Chad Baker leaving...

Wildwood13 wrote:

I am not buying what most of you guys are selling on this thread. First, players transfer for numerous reasons but the four most which includes 95% of the reasons a player transfers are 1. A coaching change.( no fault of the new coach) 2. A player was under recruited and has displayed he can play at a higher level and wants to play at that higher level to showcase his skills. ( shows the coach can find players) 3. A player was over recruited and in order to play in college he must transfer to a lower program or division. ( illustrates that the coach has trouble identifying what kind of talent it takes to compete at this level) 4 player and coach just don’t see eye to eye or the player is homesick.( this kind of falls on the coach for not really knowing the personality of the player)

In scenario 1. The first year or two Dambrot lost a few of Ferry’s recruits which is understandable. Scenario 2 I think the only player that falls into this category is Eric Williams. But at the tail end of Williams tenure here, he and the coach didn’t not see eye to eye. Scenario 3, Dambrot has brought in more than 20 players that are not A10 quality players and they left the program for lesser schools. The final scenario it seems to me that only four players have fallen into this category. Mike Lewis, Eric Williams, Sin Carey and now Chad Baker. What is very strange to me about these players is that they all got considerable playing time and started most of the time. What happened is anyone’s guess. But regardless, why play these players so much if they were giving bad attitudes or causing problems. It’s the coaches job, first to know the talent, then to know the recruit will fit into your beliefs and then to build a strong relationship with that player. I feel Dambrot has failed miserably at knowing what talent it takes to win at the A10 level. I feel he only had a good relationship with three players to date. Mike Hughes, Weathers and Dunn. Under all the scenarios that I listed, most of the problems with our revolving door of players falls on the coaching staff.

I agree with some of that.  I just want to clarify though that Mike Lewis was a Ferry recruit so he would fall into your "scenario 1."  
 

 

4/21/2021 11:50 am  #27


Re: Chad Baker leaving...

Styles1229 wrote:

Wildwood13 wrote:

I am not buying what most of you guys are selling on this thread. First, players transfer for numerous reasons but the four most which includes 95% of the reasons a player transfers are 1. A coaching change.( no fault of the new coach) 2. A player was under recruited and has displayed he can play at a higher level and wants to play at that higher level to showcase his skills. ( shows the coach can find players) 3. A player was over recruited and in order to play in college he must transfer to a lower program or division. ( illustrates that the coach has trouble identifying what kind of talent it takes to compete at this level) 4 player and coach just don’t see eye to eye or the player is homesick.( this kind of falls on the coach for not really knowing the personality of the player)
In scenario 1. The first year or two Dambrot lost a few of Ferry’s recruits which is understandable. Scenario 2 I think the only player that falls into this category is Eric Williams. But at the tail end of Williams tenure here, he and the coach didn’t not see eye to eye. Scenario 3, Dambrot has brought in more than 20 players that are not A10 quality players and they left the program for lesser schools. The final scenario it seems to me that only four players have fallen into this category. Mike Lewis, Eric Williams, Sin Carey and now Chad Baker. What is very strange to me about these players is that they all got considerable playing time and started most of the time. What happened is anyone’s guess. But regardless, why play these players so much if they were giving bad attitudes or causing problems. It’s the coaches job, first to know the talent, then to know the recruit will fit into your beliefs and then to build a strong relationship with that player. I feel Dambrot has failed miserably at knowing what talent it takes to win at the A10 level. I feel he only had a good relationship with three players to date. Mike Hughes, Weathers and Dunn. Under all the scenarios that I listed, most of the problems with our revolving door of players falls on the coaching staff.

I agree with some of that.  I just want to clarify though that Mike Lewis was a Ferry recruit so he would fall into your "scenario 1."  
 

I AM buying what most of you guys are selling on this thread. As for most of the problems with our revolving door of players falling on the coaching staff? ... I doubt it. This coaching staff has things under control, especially in this seemingly uncontrollable environment. I love Dambrot's attitude: If you want to play at Duquesne, pay attention and do your job. We're in charge. You'll carry out our orders. Period.
Good job, Duquesne coaching staff!

 

4/21/2021 12:02 pm  #28


Re: Chad Baker leaving...

Wildwood13 wrote:

I am not buying what most of you guys are selling on this thread. First, players transfer for numerous reasons but the four most which includes 95% of the reasons a player transfers are 1. A coaching change.( no fault of the new coach) 2. A player was under recruited and has displayed he can play at a higher level and wants to play at that higher level to showcase his skills. ( shows the coach can find players) 3. A player was over recruited and in order to play in college he must transfer to a lower program or division. ( illustrates that the coach has trouble identifying what kind of talent it takes to compete at this level) 4 player and coach just don’t see eye to eye or the player is homesick.( this kind of falls on the coach for not really knowing the personality of the player)

In scenario 1. The first year or two Dambrot lost a few of Ferry’s recruits which is understandable. Scenario 2 I think the only player that falls into this category is Eric Williams. But at the tail end of Williams tenure here, he and the coach didn’t not see eye to eye. Scenario 3, Dambrot has brought in more than 20 players that are not A10 quality players and they left the program for lesser schools. The final scenario it seems to me that only four players have fallen into this category. Mike Lewis, Eric Williams, Sin Carey and now Chad Baker. What is very strange to me about these players is that they all got considerable playing time and started most of the time. What happened is anyone’s guess. But regardless, why play these players so much if they were giving bad attitudes or causing problems. It’s the coaches job, first to know the talent, then to know the recruit will fit into your beliefs and then to build a strong relationship with that player. I feel Dambrot has failed miserably at knowing what talent it takes to win at the A10 level. I feel he only had a good relationship with three players to date. Mike Hughes, Weathers and Dunn. Under all the scenarios that I listed, most of the problems with our revolving door of players falls on the coaching staff.

When you win 58% of your games at Duquesne, including 51% in the conference, especially with what he inherited, I don't see what problems are falling on his shoulders. You have zero clue what has gone on between this coach and any of the players, so all you're doing is spouting garbage. I suppose in a day and age in which 1,100 kids enter the transfer portal (Pitt was destroyed by it), you had to dig deep into some personal hatred to come up with this.

I'll continue to have faith in the Coach and the program. If you don't, you can always hop on another bus, Gus. 

 

4/21/2021 1:20 pm  #29


Re: Chad Baker leaving...

Agree with Crosseye and ElDuque on this one. Toe the line or get in another line!
KD wants discipline and when dealing with youngsters, even 21 year olds who should know better, it's got to be difficult. Wouldn't want his job no how no way!

 

4/21/2021 1:23 pm  #30


Re: Chad Baker leaving...

One more thought here. I believe that an above average disciplined team will win more games than an extremely talented undisciplined team ever will.

 

4/21/2021 1:25 pm  #31


Re: Chad Baker leaving...

The thing to me that is overlooked by all these players transferring is the biggest gift-a high quality
education and if you stay and put your 4 years in at a school like Duquesne,you have alumni who
can help you get that first job. Showing loyalty is a fine quality to have and its a quality that defines you.

 

4/21/2021 2:15 pm  #32


Re: Chad Baker leaving...

ElDuque wrote:

Wildwood13 wrote:

I am not buying what most of you guys are selling on this thread. First, players transfer for numerous reasons but the four most which includes 95% of the reasons a player transfers are 1. A coaching change.( no fault of the new coach) 2. A player was under recruited and has displayed he can play at a higher level and wants to play at that higher level to showcase his skills. ( shows the coach can find players) 3. A player was over recruited and in order to play in college he must transfer to a lower program or division. ( illustrates that the coach has trouble identifying what kind of talent it takes to compete at this level) 4 player and coach just don’t see eye to eye or the player is homesick.( this kind of falls on the coach for not really knowing the personality of the player)

In scenario 1. The first year or two Dambrot lost a few of Ferry’s recruits which is understandable. Scenario 2 I think the only player that falls into this category is Eric Williams. But at the tail end of Williams tenure here, he and the coach didn’t not see eye to eye. Scenario 3, Dambrot has brought in more than 20 players that are not A10 quality players and they left the program for lesser schools. The final scenario it seems to me that only four players have fallen into this category. Mike Lewis, Eric Williams, Sin Carey and now Chad Baker. What is very strange to me about these players is that they all got considerable playing time and started most of the time. What happened is anyone’s guess. But regardless, why play these players so much if they were giving bad attitudes or causing problems. It’s the coaches job, first to know the talent, then to know the recruit will fit into your beliefs and then to build a strong relationship with that player. I feel Dambrot has failed miserably at knowing what talent it takes to win at the A10 level. I feel he only had a good relationship with three players to date. Mike Hughes, Weathers and Dunn. Under all the scenarios that I listed, most of the problems with our revolving door of players falls on the coaching staff.

When you win 58% of your games at Duquesne, including 51% in the conference, especially with what he inherited, I don't see what problems are falling on his shoulders. You have zero clue what has gone on between this coach and any of the players, so all you're doing is spouting garbage. I suppose in a day and age in which 1,100 kids enter the transfer portal (Pitt was destroyed by it), you had to dig deep into some personal hatred to come up with this.

I'll continue to have faith in the Coach and the program. If you don't, you can always hop on another bus, Gus. 

Why does Wildwood have to be castigated for offering his opinion?

It seems to me that anyone that is willing to speculate that another poster is digging deep "into some personal hatred", might want to give a bit more thought about just who is "spouting garbage" with "zero clue" of what is going on in the other poster's mind.  

I only agree with about 60% of what Wildwood wrote but, I don't see anything in his post that warrants this treatment.

 

4/21/2021 2:22 pm  #33


Re: Chad Baker leaving...

Phil, thanks for the support. But I consider the source. Same person that put an inappropriate and inaccurate post regarding a former beloved poster.

 

4/21/2021 3:26 pm  #34


Re: Chad Baker leaving...

I plan to wait until October to see who is on the roster.
Info will leak while the team practices on who will start and the 
bench rotation.
Next is the start of season in November when the team
plays meaningful games.
At that point, I will  begin to evaluate KD and staff.
Since we don't recruit any 4 or 5 star players, the players that are leaving, though
talented, are replaceable.
As for now, I am entertained from all that is happening.


 

 

4/21/2021 3:30 pm  #35


Re: Chad Baker leaving...

The way I see it a coach much have a pretty good reason to jettison one of his most talented players and that hasn't happened too often around here. Robert Mitchell comes to mind.

 

4/21/2021 3:43 pm  #36


Re: Chad Baker leaving...

I agree with the fact we don’t recruit 4 or 5 star players, therefore these guys are replaceable. My question is, why did Dambrot play Baker so much if he was that big of a distraction. He took time away from Acuff and Okani.

 

4/21/2021 4:04 pm  #37


Re: Chad Baker leaving...

Wildwood13 wrote:

I agree with the fact we don’t recruit 4 or 5 star players, therefore these guys are replaceable. My question is, why did Dambrot play Baker so much if he was that big of a distraction. He took time away from Acuff and Okani.

Good question that we probably will never get an answer to. 

 

4/21/2021 4:10 pm  #38


Re: Chad Baker leaving...

Hopefully Ayers steps into his spot and gives us what we expected from Baker. 

 

4/21/2021 4:23 pm  #39


Re: Chad Baker leaving...

Wildwood wrote: "My question is, why did Dambrot play Baker so much if he was that big of a distraction. "  Answer:  Because, Baker was better than any one of them, even with his warts.

 

4/21/2021 5:11 pm  #40


Re: Chad Baker leaving...

stew wrote:

There will be more transfers to come and we will see promising players come and go.The constant
transferring hurts college basketball but thats life in the whole world of sports.I have no interest in
baseball because free agency has destroyed the Pirates. Its all about money.

Yeah thanks to the transfer rules we are now a double A team for the Big Boys. We have constant turnover every year as we lose players to Power 5 conferences and we replace them with guys from VMI and the like!  This is really starting to depress me.
 


Habemus victus Richmond, et Bonnies et Dayton.
Nunc vincere Atlanticum 10
 

4/21/2021 5:29 pm  #41


Re: Chad Baker leaving...

To respond (hopefully respectfully) to some of Wildwood's scenarios: It is true that some of KD's recruits didn't pan out. Maybe they looked good but weren't. Maybe he thought he could develop them but didn't. Evaluating talent isn't precise. Maybe the player thought he was A-10 caliber or knew he wasn't but was willing to give it a try. If there is anything good about this new transfer portal it's that players don't waste a year anymore to start somewhere rather than be a reserve. As far as knowing a player's personality, what about a player who says all the right things to land that scholarship? The best mental health professionals in the world admit their ability to detect deception is limited. And how do you figure out who will get homesick? One good romantic partner cures that. 

 

4/21/2021 5:30 pm  #42


Re: Chad Baker leaving...

Tejas_Duke wrote:

stew wrote:

There will be more transfers to come and we will see promising players come and go.The constant
transferring hurts college basketball but thats life in the whole world of sports.I have no interest in
baseball because free agency has destroyed the Pirates. Its all about money.

Yeah thanks to the transfer rules we are now a double A team for the Big Boys. We have constant turnover every year as we lose players to Power 5 conferences and we replace them with guys from VMI and the like!  This is really starting to depress me.
 

Take heart Tejas.

For at least the first 1-3 years of this brave new college basketball world, Duquesne stands to gain from this transfer anarchy. This program doesn't currently have any stars that schools that are consistently ranked in the Top 25 are going to go out of their way to poach while DU is bringing in some transfers with proven talent, experience, production &  multiple years of remaining eligibility. How likely would it have been last spring or any of the last 10 springs that players with the upside of Williams & Ayers would have matriculated on The Bluff?

 

4/21/2021 7:38 pm  #43


Re: Chad Baker leaving...

This didn't surprise me at all.  Based on comments during the season made by Dambrot about Baker driving him crazy, and his postgame comments after the A10 tournament, I expected as much.  Remember the game where Baker was ushered off the floor in the closing minutes by an assistant while Dambrot was steaming on the sidelines?  I don't know what the dynamic was that was going on between them, but clearly one of them had to go.  

 

4/21/2021 8:37 pm  #44


Re: Chad Baker leaving...

I expected this along with a couple others leaving. The landscape has changed with the new transfer rules. i was wondering how Baker would have fit in given the talent the Dukes have brought in. Williams Gunn, and Ayers will all be go to scorers along with the trio of freshmen Johnson, Spears, and Barba, Throw in TDM, Harris, Acuff, and Okahni along with Maceo nd you've got more than a enough talent to compete. Hopefully, Hima will work out and I always root for Rotroff, but think he'll be hitting the portal. Just my opinion. Just need to grab the likes of a Groce, Rebraca (appears he's going to Iowa from what i've read), Wright from Western Michigan, or even Rice from Citadel and we'll be sitting pretty.
 

 

4/21/2021 9:46 pm  #45


Re: Chad Baker leaving...

Rayrich wrote:

I expected this along with a couple others leaving. The landscape has changed with the new transfer rules. i was wondering how Baker would have fit in given the talent the Dukes have brought in. Williams Gunn, and Ayers will all be go to scorers along with the trio of freshmen Johnson, Spears, and Barba,
 

Yeah but here's the problem, we're always going back to square 1.  We all hoped at the beginning of this year that next year's team would be an upper class driven team, led by veterans and now here we are again, with one senior, who most us really weren't excited to see back and everyone else gone, and the team looks like it did in Year #1, and let's be honest some of that "talent" you speak of hasn't proven anything in the college ranks yet. Lots of talent flames out!  Just getting sick of this, but hey at least we will be an 8-10 win A 10 team who never goes to the Big Dance, instead of our usual 5-6 win team, so there's that!  This transfer thing sucks!
 

Last edited by Tejas_Duke (4/21/2021 9:47 pm)


Habemus victus Richmond, et Bonnies et Dayton.
Nunc vincere Atlanticum 10
 

4/22/2021 7:31 am  #46


Re: Chad Baker leaving...

I don't know how many of you have been around since Duquesne lost to UNC in NCAA 1969 or last made the NCAA tourney in 1977 (or if any of you are still paying attention to this now long thread).  I am one who saw the loss to UNC and all that happened since. 

Keith Dambrot is the best coach we have had here since Red Manning (maybe except for Mike Rice though he certainly wasn't perfect).  He is in the best position to get Duquesne back.  He has the support of a solid AD in Harper and a top President in Gormley.  The difference now is the transfer portal and the transfer mess created in part by the pandemic. 

Might there be a time when I would agree that the problem is Keith Dambrot?  Sure - no one is perfect.  But that would take many more years after what should be a contract extension assuming he accepts.  Why?  Because I have lived long enough to see the freaking mess that Duquesne basketball has been over the years with coach after coach and AD after AD and President after President all failing in ways large and small.  And the situation now is even more complicated.  This is the best Duquesne has looked both academically and athletically in many many years. 

If Baker was creating problems (like some that we saw with the T's) then he should go.  If it was KD's choice then I applaud him for taking control, for being in charge, for not accepting someone challenging his system.

Again, Keith Dambrot's contract should be extended.  And you can end this thread now.

 

4/22/2021 8:01 am  #47


Re: Chad Baker leaving...

Mulder wrote:

I don't know how many of you have been around since Duquesne lost to UNC in NCAA 1969 or last made the NCAA tourney in 1977 (or if any of you are still paying attention to this now long thread).  I am one who saw the loss to UNC and all that happened since. 

Keith Dambrot is the best coach we have had here since Red Manning (maybe except for Mike Rice though he certainly wasn't perfect).  He is in the best position to get Duquesne back.  He has the support of a solid AD in Harper and a top President in Gormley.  The difference now is the transfer portal and the transfer mess created in part by the pandemic. 

Might there be a time when I would agree that the problem is Keith Dambrot?  Sure - no one is perfect.  But that would take many more years after what should be a contract extension assuming he accepts.  Why?  Because I have lived long enough to see the freaking mess that Duquesne basketball has been over the years with coach after coach and AD after AD and President after President all failing in ways large and small.  And the situation now is even more complicated.  This is the best Duquesne has looked both academically and athletically in many many years. 

If Baker was creating problems (like some that we saw with the T's) then he should go.  If it was KD's choice then I applaud him for taking control, for being in charge, for not accepting someone challenging his system.

Again, Keith Dambrot's contract should be extended.  And you can end this thread now.

Mulder  great post. Well articulated & thought out👍

 

4/22/2021 8:22 am  #48


Re: Chad Baker leaving...

Ironduke81 wrote:

Mulder wrote:

I don't know how many of you have been around since Duquesne lost to UNC in NCAA 1969 or last made the NCAA tourney in 1977 (or if any of you are still paying attention to this now long thread).  I am one who saw the loss to UNC and all that happened since. 

Keith Dambrot is the best coach we have had here since Red Manning (maybe except for Mike Rice though he certainly wasn't perfect).  He is in the best position to get Duquesne back.  He has the support of a solid AD in Harper and a top President in Gormley.  The difference now is the transfer portal and the transfer mess created in part by the pandemic. 

Might there be a time when I would agree that the problem is Keith Dambrot?  Sure - no one is perfect.  But that would take many more years after what should be a contract extension assuming he accepts.  Why?  Because I have lived long enough to see the freaking mess that Duquesne basketball has been over the years with coach after coach and AD after AD and President after President all failing in ways large and small.  And the situation now is even more complicated.  This is the best Duquesne has looked both academically and athletically in many many years. 

If Baker was creating problems (like some that we saw with the T's) then he should go.  If it was KD's choice then I applaud him for taking control, for being in charge, for not accepting someone challenging his system.

Again, Keith Dambrot's contract should be extended.  And you can end this thread now.

Mulder  great post. Well articulated & thought out👍

Yes, When looking at the history it's almost a no brainer, no offense to some previous posts. I was too young to remember the 69 loss but I did grow up in the 70's when they still had a slight aura...that's gone. Dambrot has the right blood lines. covid-19 n the transfers have played a significant role. As previously stated Baker has the talent but he appeared uncoachable. He did what he wanted which can be selfish to the team concept. Think of this generation. Respect is a hard thing to come by in this day and age...n I do have 3 teenagers for anyone that feels offended which I hope isn't the case

 

4/22/2021 9:21 am  #49


Re: Chad Baker leaving...

What Mulder said.

 

4/22/2021 9:53 am  #50


Re: Chad Baker leaving...

Mulder wrote:

I don't know how many of you have been around since Duquesne lost to UNC in NCAA 1969 or last made the NCAA tourney in 1977 (or if any of you are still paying attention to this now long thread).  I am one who saw the loss to UNC and all that happened since. 

Keith Dambrot is the best coach we have had here since Red Manning (maybe except for Mike Rice though he certainly wasn't perfect).  He is in the best position to get Duquesne back.  He has the support of a solid AD in Harper and a top President in Gormley.  The difference now is the transfer portal and the transfer mess created in part by the pandemic. 

Might there be a time when I would agree that the problem is Keith Dambrot?  Sure - no one is perfect.  But that would take many more years after what should be a contract extension assuming he accepts.  Why?  Because I have lived long enough to see the freaking mess that Duquesne basketball has been over the years with coach after coach and AD after AD and President after President all failing in ways large and small.  And the situation now is even more complicated.  This is the best Duquesne has looked both academically and athletically in many many years. 

If Baker was creating problems (like some that we saw with the T's) then he should go.  If it was KD's choice then I applaud him for taking control, for being in charge, for not accepting someone challenging his system.

Again, Keith Dambrot's contract should be extended.  And you can end this thread now.

Hear, Hear Mulder!  I don't know if any of us know how incredibly difficult it was for the players and coaches navigating through all of the issues surrounding the pandemic - both in their personal lives and on the court.  I just flushed the 20-21 season; I'm with Econ69 - I'm looking forward to the 21-22 season!

 

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