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ADD ME to those who are completly frustrated -- Al, I'll bet a hot dog and an order of nachos and your choice of a drink on this one: We will NOT win 4 in a row. Three consecutive roads games. We're hearing complaints about the way they play at Consol, and yesterday they looked lost on their own home court. Watch St. Francis hand us our butts. Soko, White, Watkins, Jerry Jones, McKoy start - or we will probably lose As I was leaving the building today I bumped into a long time friend who is one of the true pillars of support for the program. He said, "Maybe we should just quit." I replied, "Maybe you're right." Ok, at the risk of beating my own admittedly deceased equine about how this teacher married to an accountant wanted to make a $60,000 donation to the U from his parents money......and was basically told to shut up about it.... To me, Team is a snapshot. A look at one year. Last edited by steve19981 (12/15/2013 10:20 am) Lol. You took a lot of time not to say those things. I agree w/ most of the things you didn't say. Except for, we have to wait 3 or 4 more years. Westender - I'm glad we are able to laugh a little today. We are who we are. Tough to swallow sometimes. About the game-Since I live in Fl I watch over the internet feed and it is usually a court view, with some replays going on during live action. The two guards( ninth grade sized ) seem to attack the zone by driving into a crowd and throw up wild shots, sometimes hitting the underside of the rim but seldom going in the basket. Even when they get a turnover they some how blow. Example :DC driving an long the sideline with a defender on him like glue and he steps on the line, turnover. Before Mason was hurt I saw many times Mason wide open on the left side and DC launching threes from around 25 ft with a taller defender in his face. Soko who I thought would dominate playing out of control. And it goes on and on. I tried to stay neutral on RE, didn't like the way he was treated, but he always had a good OOC record even though the Dukes often faded we were a 500 plus team. This loss has sucked the hope out of what is left of the DU fan base. Hard to understand how anybody could claim we are on the right track after what we have seen so far this year. Jim Ferry was hired to bring hope that DU will get to the next level. I know it is still early, but Ferry at least to me has shown no evidence he has what it takes to out recruit, teach, or coach any of the coaches and team in the A10. I said this earlier but this team has so far played like a selfish, undisciplined, and poorly coached AAU team. Hard to take the tweets from the RMU fans claiming they are DU's big brother. Thanks Greg. Steve, the program clearly sucks if it can't put a decent team on the court. Believe me, I'm not trying to convince you of anything because you clearly have a different idea of what works and how. I guess it's safer to live in a world like that, or it must at least seem that way. Just spoke with an out of town buddy. He said two things. 1. Duquesne Stinks. 2. Arizona is #1. Al, GA didn't fire RE with the intention of hiring Dambrot. He fired RE with the intention of hiring Dino Gaudio. The vitriol that came from this board, and other places, caught GA off guard. Gaudio got wind of it, and decided he wanted no part of the situation. Dambrot became the second option after Gaudio backed off. You think this board is negative now, I can't imagine how bad it would be if this was happening under Gaudio. Al, GA didn't fire RE with the intention of hiring Dambrot. He fired RE with the intention of hiring Dino Gaudio. The vitriol that came from this board, and other places, caught GA off guard. Gaudio got wind of it, and decided he wanted no part of the situation. Dambrot became the second option after Gaudio backed off. You think this board is negative now, I can't imagine how bad it would be if this was happening under Gaudio. Totally agree with your assessment. That is what happens when you are the AD and don't have the slightest clue about what your fan base is thinking. The biggest problem I have with Ferry, and to be fair, it was my biggest pet peeve about RE as well, is that they are "system" coaches. I would just once, love to hear an incoming coach say, "I really don't have a system. I will bring in the best players I can, and we'll play a style that best fits their abilities". I actually heard a coach say that recently, and it made me jealous. We've been hiring guys for 40 years who always promise that "we will run, and be exciting, and players will want to come here". I'm sick of this nonsense. Pitt plods year after year, and they win year after year. When Mason returns, and if we get Robinson, we need to slow it down, and give Mason the green light. If he's the shooter we think he is, that will loosen up the zone, and allow us to get the ball to our bigs with some space to work. Shrimps driving to the hoop will fail. This is worse than Talley and Eric Evans, and that was pretty bad. I don't know what Ferry was thinking about with these midgets. To run the system he likes, you need guards with enough size to finish. I understand that he needed someone to run the point last year, and that he came in late. He should have brought in a juco last year (I guess he did, but Binney sucked). I'm not sold on Ridenhour, but Ferry probably needs to throw him in there, and see if he can grow into the role. No one's job should be safe, even Soko's. Last edited by duq81 (12/15/2013 3:01 pm) Steve, the program clearly sucks if it can't put a decent team on the court. Believe me, I'm not trying to convince you of anything because you clearly have a different idea of what works and how. I guess it's safer to live in a world like that, or it must at least seem that way. This isn't a world I live in to protect myself. I just see the situation differently. It's not as black and white as you make it out to be. And this presumption that Amodio was saving his skin by firing Ron presumes that GA's job was actually in jeopardy. What proof do you have of that? I actually think there may be some truth in that. No proof, but RE was going to be in hot water, even if he had kept his job. While I personally thought RE should have been retained, I didn't think he deserved an extension at that point, especially after TJ bailed. With him only having 2 years left on his deal, that meant he would be coaching for his job the following year, as you just can't let your coach be a lame duck. Considering the returning talent, I thought RE would have a real tough row to hoe to keep his job, and if the team had a really bad year, that there would be calls to clean house, which would include GA. GA may have seen this coming, and decided to see if he could fire RE now, rather than risk going down with the ship. The move caught most of us off guard, and because no one saw it coming, there was no chance to loudly suggest that GA ought to be out the door as well. Had RE been kept, and the season gone badly, what would have happened, is that a lot of RE's support would have dried up, and the small group that was already against him, would have grown much bigger, with even some of those who are angry about how things actually played out, agreeing that RE had to go. The problem for GA, is that once it becomes apparent that Ron is toast, people would quickly begin to suggest that GA needed to be toast as well. The press would quickly pick this up, and I think GA would have gotten the boot along with Ron. Has Fordham changed AD'd lately? if not, is he under fire? Steve, you seem to talk out of both sides of your mouth in your defense of Amodio. You say Ron's recruiting fell off yet he still won with the guys you trash. You say Everhart was mediocre yet he played for the A10 championship in his thrid year. Elsewhere you have said progress is not linear in defending Ferry, but because Ron had a slight drop off in years four and five (yet still won) you threw him under the bus and say he deserved to be fired. You talked elsewhere about coaches in the A10 who had several losing seasons before making an upward move in the A10 but think RE was not deserving of more time. Last edited by CLK (12/15/2013 5:02 pm) Steve 19981 wrote: Last edited by Westender (12/15/2013 5:13 pm) Steve, it's perfectly black and white. Look at what Robert Morris has accomplished during the past four years, not only against us, but in the postseason. Look at how hard and far we fell last season -- we were not a bottom-feeder under Ron Everhart. We are now. Steve 19981 wrote: Steve 19981 wrote: Well we've come full circle again, it's back to the dart game of throwing at RE, GA, Dr. D or JF depending on who is doing the throwing. Steve, I think El D has a fair point about the big men under Ron, but Ferry should get more time than 1 1/4 season's and El D the bottom feeding doesn't happen with the flip of a switch - it was definitely trending that way. Jason Duty, c'mon, if we had to play a slow moving walk on over scholarship guys, then what does that tell you about the quality of what we were recruiting. Steve you at least give RE credit when you give your view, and he deserves credit, but CLK your passion and defense of RE seems a bit over the top. You guys will recall where I stand on all of that from 1 1/2 years ago, but I think the reality is if Ferry flops GA goes too and he probably realizes that and that is how it should be. No one is more disgusted with what happened yesterday than me, and they have to win me back (my new name can be mr. bandwagon) before I show up to another game, but logic dictates that the school should evaluate after more time and that can be debated. My guess is that JF better do something by the end of year 3 or he'll be gone to, i don't think he gets any more time after that.
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Re: #3 in the city of Pittsburgh
Am NOT one of the bigger donors -- do make a small donation to the School's General Fund - Am SOLELY tempted to take my tickets rip them up and mail them to the Athletic Department with a note saying "You have a NO Refunds/Exchange Policy" I have a "don't throw away good money after bad" I conisder the unused tickets my donation for 2014!! Please remove my name from the Athletic Department's Mailing List -- I DON'T want to receive any more Golf Flyers (my game is bad enough without spending the 100-150 for another round) I DON'T want any more invitations to the A-10 Tourney in Brooklyn (If I'm not going to go to Palumbo to watch Appalachian State pound us -- I'm not going to go to Brooklyn and watch Fordham do it) And DON'T send me a Ticket Application for 2014 -- P T Barnum was right when he said "There's a Sucker Born Every Minute" I got DIBS on xx/xx/AM xx/xx/1956
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Re: #3 in the city of Pittsburgh
You left one out. I love when I get an email inviting me to an evening with the coach to discuss Duquesne basketball so he can discuss the X and O's!!! Really! I also rationalized my season tickets this year as a donation to the athletic department, along with the $200. we pay to sit in blue seats near the front. As I said before, GA, if he had planned to fire RE, should have talked to the coach from Akron or had some idea he would come before he fired the current coach. ALSO, I firmly believe that from the second game of the season, we have gotten worse instead of better. That is definitely on Ferry.
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Re: #3 in the city of Pittsburgh
•
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Re: #3 in the city of Pittsburgh
My biggest issue is no defense again. Yes, we can't play against a zone and our best 3 point shooter is hurt. But look at all of the 3's we have given up the last two games!!! That has nothing to do with us not being able to shoot the 3.
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Re: #3 in the city of Pittsburgh
VBC wrote:
I know of another long time, big check writing booster who bailed before this season. The booster who is asking if we should quit is substantially more important than the ex-booster whom I'm referring to.
.
Dougherty's phone should be rining off the hook tomorrow. His personal assistant is a very pleasant woman who will listen to you and hear you out. He needs to know the sound of the checkbooks SLAMMING SHUT! Now!!!!!!!!!!!!
All this talk on a message board of stopping support and not going anymore and not renewing season tickets is just internet bloviating! Stop talking and act! Act now!
Phones ringing the hook, starting tomorrow! Got it!
Vicimus Atlanticum decem
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Re: #3 in the city of Pittsburgh
Program is the resources, potential and capacity that a team has. As bad as Duquesne has been in this series, their capacity for success is still much greater than Robert Morris' even if they haven't realized it.
Also I believe we agreed to disagree on this previously. I'm about as interested in having this conversation again as Kurt is in reading it.
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Re: #3 in the city of Pittsburgh
Kurt - that was funny! I really did not intend to make a statement while claiming I was not doing so. But I can see where you are coming from. One correction to your post though - I am not saying to wait 3 or 4 more years. The hammer comes in years 3 or 4. I really thought we would beat R Morris this year - I don't understand it. It is never acceptable to lose to them, and that includes the losses that took place under RE. The severe suffering and frustration of long time supporters is palpable, as it should be, especially for those of us who remember those long gone glory days while Robert Morris was a JC or some kind would be business school. It's hard not to hide our faces in shame these days.
Re: #3 in the city of Pittsburgh
Tejas Duke - count me out. I tried that whole calling thing. There are deaf ears at the top. I'm not trying to dissuade others from doing what they believe is necessary. But after only 20 years of this mess, I'm convinced no one there cares. They all seem to get paid whether they win or lose. With the exception of RE, and the occasional soccer coach.
Someone else said it, they have NO CLUE that beating RM means something to the faithful. To be that unprepared, no amount or screaming or yelling will change that. IMO.
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Re: #3 in the city of Pittsburgh
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Re: #3 in the city of Pittsburgh
I saw many great games at the Arena and Palumbo over the years , that may not be the case this year. This team reminds me of Scott Edgar's last year when we lost to Radnor and Youngstown State at AJ, teams we paid to come in and be beaten .
Just a little thought, we used to beat Xavier annually, often scoring over 100 points, and their fans used to comment that they hoped to have a program as great a Duquesne. We not only fell years ago but have never gotten back up.
A diehard fan since 1961
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Re: #3 in the city of Pittsburgh
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Re: #3 in the city of Pittsburgh
You look around the country at coaches who have inherited bad programs with fewer resources and have managed to be successful. I listened to an interview with the Fordham coach recently. If there has been a worse A-10 team than Duquesne, it's Fordham. The guy's there two years and is impatient to win, and by winning, he intends to get into the NCAA Tournament. He has the oldest basketball facility in the country, the Bronx scares the hell out of most people, and he has to recruit against St. John's and every top program in the country that wants NYC talent.
And last season he snagged Jon Severe.
I know you don't like to hear this Steve, but the problem goes back two years when everyone and their fathers were looking to stab Ron Everhart in the back. Greg fired him to save his own skin, didn't get to bring his cronie friend in, ended up with Ferry, and off we go. Bash Ron, make excuses, dump all of Ron's kids, bring in a full roster, and then look like a team full of walk-ons. Ferry had a year to see the A-10 and still thought Colter was his PG. And we're still looking for big men, and knuckleheads are trying to poke holes into Donovan Jack.
I would trade Colter, White and Soko for Jack and a point guard from any Top 20 program in New Jersey.
Like I told Kurt, a guy keeps socking you in the face and knocking you on your tukus, you can't sit there and say, "I have a bigger house than you. I have a prettier wife than you. I'm the tougher guy."
Your program sucks. Your program, Greg's program, Ferry's program. It sucks. I feel sorry for the people who have put money into it because they got screwed.
Dr. Dougherty, clean house and bring back Ron! •
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Re: #3 in the city of Pittsburgh
Enuf said
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Re: #3 in the city of Pittsburgh
FAM wrote:
You left one out. I love when I get an email inviting me to an evening with the coach to discuss Duquesne basketball so he can discuss the X and O's!!! Really! I also rationalized my season tickets this year as a donation to the athletic department, along with the $200. we pay to sit in blue seats near the front. As I said before, GA, if he had planned to fire RE, should have talked to the coach from Akron or had some idea he would come before he fired the current coach. ALSO, I firmly believe that from the second game of the season, we have gotten worse instead of better. That is definitely on Ferry.
Re: #3 in the city of Pittsburgh
duq81 wrote:FAM wrote:
You left one out. I love when I get an email inviting me to an evening with the coach to discuss Duquesne basketball so he can discuss the X and O's!!! Really! I also rationalized my season tickets this year as a donation to the athletic department, along with the $200. we pay to sit in blue seats near the front. As I said before, GA, if he had planned to fire RE, should have talked to the coach from Akron or had some idea he would come before he fired the current coach. ALSO, I firmly believe that from the second game of the season, we have gotten worse instead of better. That is definitely on Ferry.
They won't fire GA, I just hope there are bigger fools than us that would perhaps hire him away.
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ElDuque wrote:
You look around the country at coaches who have inherited bad programs with fewer resources and have managed to be successful. I listened to an interview with the Fordham coach recently. If there has been a worse A-10 team than Duquesne, it's Fordham. The guy's there two years and is impatient to win, and by winning, he intends to get into the NCAA Tournament. He has the oldest basketball facility in the country, the Bronx scares the hell out of most people, and he has to recruit against St. John's and every top program in the country that wants NYC talent.
And last season he snagged Jon Severe.
I know you don't like to hear this Steve, but the problem goes back two years when everyone and their fathers were looking to stab Ron Everhart in the back. Greg fired him to save his own skin, didn't get to bring his cronie friend in, ended up with Ferry, and off we go. Bash Ron, make excuses, dump all of Ron's kids, bring in a full roster, and then look like a team full of walk-ons. Ferry had a year to see the A-10 and still thought Colter was his PG. And we're still looking for big men, and knuckleheads are trying to poke holes into Donovan Jack.
I would trade Colter, White and Soko for Jack and a point guard from any Top 20 program in New Jersey.
Like I told Kurt, a guy keeps socking you in the face and knocking you on your tukus, you can't sit there and say, "I have a bigger house than you. I have a prettier wife than you. I'm the tougher guy."
Your program sucks. Your program, Greg's program, Ferry's program. It sucks. I feel sorry for the people who have put money into it because they got screwed.
Dr. Dougherty, clean house and bring back Ron!
Pecora just started his fourth year at Fordham and hasn't won more than 10 games in a season yet. I don't think he's a great counter balance to the argument. Arena aside, Fordham's not bereft of resources. They do put the average amount of money into the program for the a10
Listen you can blame Amodio all you want for the situation we're in with Robert Morris. Fact is Ron lost the first two games of this streak and he did so with the most talented team of the four losers. If the program is worse than Robert Morris as evidenced by this streak, you can't leave Ron blameless.
But while we're talking about living in altered worlds and if mine is gum drops and flipping lollipops for Amodio (which it isn't), you live in a parrallel universe that can't see Everhart for being mediocre. I give him total credit for turning the program around and getting to the level of decent. However, when he lost his original assistant coaches, he replaced them with chumps. Recruiting fell off a cliff after Bolding verballed including a class of 2011 that yielded nothing but a striker for the soccer team and cost the athletic department a ton of money. I like some of the class of 2012 on paper including Jack and Willie Moore, and I think he finally found a legit assistant Coundol. Maybe that trends in the right direction for him , but presuming Jack develops here the way he has at PSU is a huge reach given Everhart's track record with post players. Assuming all of those players stay for 4 years is a huge reach. On top of that, you have his record in close games, the late season collapses, and the flatlining of the program after it had all the momentum in 2009.
When the coaching change was made, I think people overlook that two decisions took place. The first was to fire Ron. I agreed with that decision at the time and I will continue to agree with that decision regardless of what's happened in hindsight. The second decision was to hire Jim Ferry. I gave Everhart 5 and half years before I "stabbed him in the back." I'm sure as heck going to give Ferry more than 19 months.
And this presumption that Amodio was saving his skin by firing Ron presumes that GA's job was actually in jeopardy. What proof do you have of that?
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Re: #3 in the city of Pittsburgh
steve19981 wrote:
All of this was set in motion a year earlier, by the collapse after the 11 game winning streak. Had the team played well enough to reach the NIT, one of two things would have happened. Either RE would have been hired away, or he would have gotten a full extension. Even if the following season had played out the way it did, with 4 years left on his deal, RE would have been able to blow the team up after TJ left (and he was going to do just that), and would have been given the time to attempt to build it back up.
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Re: #3 in the city of Pittsburgh
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Ron is not coming back, and it is time for Ferry to prove that he is what Amodio claimed he was (next level coach). I have not seen anything yet to convince me that he is a better coach than Ron even with the much larger salary and benefits and more resources. I agree with VBC when he said the coaches should be ashamed to cash thier pay check after yesterday's performane. It is absurd to blame Ron for the loss yesterday to Robert Morris. Reality is Ferry is not going to be replaced given his contract so he will have the time. Personally I would really like to see him turn things around this season and give us all some hope. It is sad to see so many long time die hard supporters walking away. Whether you can see it or not this Program is in a death spiral and Amodio as the man in charge is responsible.
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But while we're talking about living in altered worlds and if mine is gum drops and flipping lollipops for Amodio (which it isn't), you live in a parrallel universe that can't see Everhart for being mediocre. I give him total credit for turning the program around and getting to the level of decent. However, when he lost his original assistant coaches, he replaced them with chumps. Recruiting fell off a cliff after Bolding verballed including a class of 2011 that yielded nothing but a striker for the soccer team and cost the athletic department a ton of money. I like some of the class of 2012 on paper including Jack and Willie Moore, and I think he finally found a legit assistant Coundol. Maybe that trends in the right direction for him , but presuming Jack develops here the way he has at PSU is a huge reach given Everhart's track record with post players. Assuming all of those players stay for 4 years is a huge reach. On top of that, you have his record in close games, the late season collapses, and the flatlining of the program after it had all the momentum in 2009.
When the coaching change was made, I think people overlook that two decisions took place. The first was to fire Ron. I agreed with that decision at the time and I will continue to agree with that decision regardless of what's happened in hindsight.
Steve - did you do the research or actually write the report that Amodio presented to the Board to justify RE's firing. Or are you the one that leaked it to CBS in Cincinnati?
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I love your comment about Ron's inability to develop big men. He had Shawn James at least. And Achara developed under him. And we got more out of Saunders and Clark than we'll get out of any of Ferry's big men, because he refuses to play big men. I think he thinks he's coaching in the USBL.
But let's talk about point guards. Ron got more out of a walk-on (Jason Duty) than Ferry has gotten out of every guard he's brought here on scholarship.
CLK, as I said at some point over the off-season, I'm not expecting miracles. Ron was able to break .500 in his second year and I think Ferry should be held to the same standard. I agree with you, I want to see him succeed because he is probably the last shot that we have before the morons who run things pull the plug on the program and we end up in a conference with Clarion and Gannon. Perhaps this is where people want to see us end up. •
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Re: #3 in the city of Pittsburgh
Westender wrote:
But while we're talking about living in altered worlds and if mine is gum drops and flipping lollipops for Amodio (which it isn't), you live in a parrallel universe that can't see Everhart for being mediocre. I give him total credit for turning the program around and getting to the level of decent. However, when he lost his original assistant coaches, he replaced them with chumps. Recruiting fell off a cliff after Bolding verballed including a class of 2011 that yielded nothing but a striker for the soccer team and cost the athletic department a ton of money. I like some of the class of 2012 on paper including Jack and Willie Moore, and I think he finally found a legit assistant Coundol. Maybe that trends in the right direction for him , but presuming Jack develops here the way he has at PSU is a huge reach given Everhart's track record with post players. Assuming all of those players stay for 4 years is a huge reach. On top of that, you have his record in close games, the late season collapses, and the flatlining of the program after it had all the momentum in 2009.
When the coaching change was made, I think people overlook that two decisions took place. The first was to fire Ron. I agreed with that decision at the time and I will continue to agree with that decision regardless of what's happened in hindsight.
Steve - did you do the research or actually write the report that Amodio presented to the Board to justify RE's firing. Or are you the one that leaked it to CBS in Cincinnati?
Someone finally figured out it was me.
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Re: #3 in the city of Pittsburgh
Someone finally figured out it was me.
I suspected all along that it was you, and I finally had the guts to ask. You do a great service for the DU basketball community by finally owning up to your sinister behavior.
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Re: #3 in the city of Pittsburgh
