Welcome to SHOO-SHOO, RAH-RAH! The Duquesne Dukes Basketball Fan Message Board!
One of America's Great Message Boards - Any Inappropriate Posts Will Be Deleted!
Offline I wasn't able to include my handy roster chart (as a jpg scan) on this forum, so I put it on the Duquesne Basketball Facebook page earlier this evening. It has 2023-24 ppg, rpg, fg% and 3pt% along with heights and weights for the 12 nucleus players. It's revealing indeed in that you can see there's going to be a battle royale for starting positions. You have to wonder, with a roster like this - what style of basketball might evolve here? Last edited by gjgsr (6/09/2024 10:07 pm) Offline To the administrator - can you instruct me how to include my jpg file in a message here? Sorry, but I wasn't able to... Offline Offline Thank you for handling! Offline Thanks VBC. Offline After the Dukes unbelievable run this past season, it is great to feel optimistic about the future of Duquesne basketball. I'm very optimistic about where the Duquesne basketball program is today; I don't believe that the program has ever been in this good of a position to sustain a good level of consistent success. That being said, I'm less optimistic about this coming season. There are going to be expected bumps for our first year coach and staff; I'm optimistic that they will be able to adjust and learn as the season progresses. Offline Wow Phoenix,that is impressive work. Computers, probability and statistics are surely dominating most business decision these days. I don't know how many college basketball coaches are using thus type of analysis in making recruiting decisions,but my guess is more and more will be incorporating this type of analysis in the future. Offline Phoenix agree with CLK. Great job👍 Love this board. Offline I forgot to mention one other item regarding Duquesne Portal haul.One of the old fashioned measure of a recruit was who else was recruiting them. All of these guys had a long list of schools interested in them. For example. Dinkins had an official visit to U of Miami before visiting Duquesne, and several other P5 schools chasing him as listed in the attached article. I know others had canceled visits to other schools. This to me is a more meaningful comparison of their talents and expected performance. Offline Thanks, guys. These rankings and analytics are not the be all, end all way of looking at players. But I believe that every college program now uses (and sometimes pays significant money for comprehensive access to) these analytic tools. Dambrot and his staff extensively used them as a roadmap and a measurement tool. Offline Mark Twain once said that there are lies, dann lies, and then there are statistics. Offline Thanks, guys. These rankings and analytics are not the be all, end all way of looking at players. But I believe that every college program now uses (and sometimes pays significant money for comprehensive access to) these analytic tools. Dambrot and his staff extensively used them as a roadmap and a measurement tool. Not dismissing analytics at all, but Crawford, Corbett, and Edwards sure passed the "eye test" for me last year in their games against the Dukes. Offline Is it just me or do we have a taller back court? Other teams may not have as many mismatches on our defense and we can rebound more by committee. Last edited by coffee (6/14/2024 9:23 am) Offline Just wondering, but since KD's teams generally didn't push the action and therefore tended to be a low scoring team, doesn't that affect those offensive stats different then if these kids played on a faster pace team that takes more shots early on the clock and didn't take nearly 30 seconds getting the ball to one scorer? Also, walking the ball down court waste time and leaves a team with less time to set up plays and tends to make the last kid with the ball to chuck up a last second shot, thus reducing the percentage of making that shot? If your team scores an ave. of 85 per game vs 55 that would affect some measure of offensive performance. Nice work on those stats and roster. It looks like it took some time and effort putting it all together, Great looking roster for next year. Last edited by NapaDuke (6/14/2024 11:01 am) Offline Phoenix, I forgot to say I agree with you that Dinkins will probably be the key to next season. I appreciate all the information you provided my friend; I just don’t see how schools like Miami, Seton Hall, Oklahoma, Indiana, Xavier, and many others would chase after the 2,224 best player. I don’t understand the wide disconnect from what we know about the kid and the EvanMiya's performance ratings. My gut is telling me that somehow their analysis is flawed. Offline DU article. No mention of Aekins. Offline DU article. No mention of Aekins. Thanks CLK the scholarship math equals itself out!
Projected 2024-25 roster with comparative stats
Re: Projected 2024-25 roster with comparative stats
•Thread Starter
Re: Projected 2024-25 roster with comparative stats
Re: Projected 2024-25 roster with comparative stats
The idea here was to present a birds eye view of the roster nucleus - so one could 'move the pieces around,' and envision different types of offense and defense. The all important defensive capabilities were not considered here - and would obviously add another dimension to any approach taken...
•Thread Starter
Re: Projected 2024-25 roster with comparative stats
Re: Projected 2024-25 roster with comparative stats
There have been several comments about the quality and depth of this roster. When analyzing this coming year, you have to take into account what significant production the Dukes are losing with Dae Dae, Jimmy and Fousseyni; can this production be replaced? How good are the transfers coming in? As usual for me, I turned to some analytics sites and took a deep dive into the stats at EvanMiya.com to get a little clearer picture of the roster. Based purely on the production and analytics from last year, this looks to be a pretty pedestrian roster. Half of the roster is analytically average. It is really lacking in offensive firepower; where are the points going to come from?
The good news is that these analytics cover the entire year; and I trust my eyeballs over analytics. We all saw the improvements by Dixon, DiMichele, Necas, Barre and Hronsky as the season progressed. If all 5 of these players are healthy this summer, I expect that their development as players, especially offensively, will speed up significantly (remember that Dixon, Barre and Hronsky were all out of action during last summer). I really liked Edwards and Corbett's game and style watching them compete against the Dukes. I also really like what I saw on video of Edwards and Wilborn. The wild card for me is Tre Dinkins; I really don't have a feel on what the Dukes have with him. I do have faith in Dru that he will be able to coach this team, especially the transfers, up defensively. The coaching staff has their work cut out for them.
Below are the numbers and explanations on EvanMiya's performance ratings. Go Dukes!
BPR Interpretation Example: If Jimmer Fredette had an Offensive BPR of 4.5, a Defensive BPR of -0.5, and a BPR of 4.0, this would mean the following: If Fredette were on the court with 9 other D1 average players, his team’s offense would be 4.5 points per 100 possessions better than average, or if he were not on the floor and were replaced by another D1 average player. Similarly, his team’s defense would be expected to be 0.5 points per 100 possessions worse (conceding 0.5 PP100 more) while he’s on the floor. Overall, his team would be expected to outscore the opponent by 4.0 points in a 100 possession game.
Re: Projected 2024-25 roster with comparative stats
To use a statistical term, one of the few I remember is the stochastic variable of comparing kids of the same experience level, as well as system, coaching and skill development. . As you pointed players make big jumps.
There are certainly a lot of unknowns about this roster. The things I like about the transfers as a group is that they can all shoot at a high percentage. I think ti's will give us more offensive puncj than last year. The biggest unknown is how well they will defend and who will give us the tough nutted, give me the ball attitude thar Jimmy Clark had.
Re: Projected 2024-25 roster with comparative stats
Re: Projected 2024-25 roster with comparative stats
Re: Projected 2024-25 roster with comparative stats
CLK, I agree with you on Dinkins; he seemed to have a lot of interest. His raw numbers look very good; the analytical deep dive is not so friendly, especially defensively. To me, Dinkins might be the key to next season since we are very limited at guard - and the A10 has historically been a guard's league.
I think there is a lot of raw, undeveloped talent with this team. The coaching staff has their work cut out for them and I have faith that they will be able to coach up this group defensively and get them playing as a team. And hopefully playing time will be a motivator for these incoming transfers, like it was for last year's team.
Re: Projected 2024-25 roster with comparative stats
Phoenix understand what you are saying based on the above statistics, however,it is hard for me to reconcile these statistics with what my eyes are telling me. I am just wondering how much of these ratings are based on the team that the kid plays on.
In reading the definitions above it seems like it would. For example how much better would a players defensive rating be if he played with guys who played defensive?
If you were to ask me about our guards I would have said that they would be the strength of our team. I saw how Edwards, former A10 rookie of the year, played thus year. I have watched full game videos of Dinkins, Corbett and Williams and seen how they performed against P5 schools. It is just hard for me to believe these ratings.
After last year, I am more convinced than ever that defense wins championships. We were not a very good offensive team. It remains to be seen how good defensively we can be next season. We return a solid core of defensive players. I agree Dru has a big job in getting this team to play the kind of defensive that they played last season. I am hoping that they put last years trophy on the shelf and that these guys will work their tails off this summer.
Re: Projected 2024-25 roster with comparative stats
PhoenixRising2 wrote:
CLK, I agree with you on Dinkins; he seemed to have a lot of interest. His raw numbers look very good; the analytical deep dive is not so friendly, especially defensively. To me, Dinkins might be the key to next season since we are very limited at guard - and the A10 has historically been a guard's league.
I think there is a lot of raw, undeveloped talent with this team. The coaching staff has their work cut out for them and I have faith that they will be able to coach up this group defensively and get them playing as a team. And hopefully playing time will be a motivator for these incoming transfers, like it was for last year's team.
Re: Projected 2024-25 roster with comparative stats
-6'5
-6'7
-6'2
-6’4
- 5'9
But then again does size matter?
COFFEE
Attitude is everything
Re: Projected 2024-25 roster with comparative stats
Re: Projected 2024-25 roster with comparative stats
The so-called raw data shows that Tre Dinkins can flat out light it up. He scored He averaged 15.4 points while shooting 41% overall and 37% from beyond the arc. He is listed as a point guard but played the SG for most of the season for Canisus. After their point guard was injured, Tre played the point and averaged 3.6 assists. Dinkins scored 17 against Syracuse, 16 against Bonaventure, and 15 against Pitt. He scored in double digits in all but 5 games and more than 20 points in six games. His high point score of 30 game against Rider.
To put this into perspective Grant averaged 16.4 ppg, 39% overall and 34% three point and 2.4 apg. Clark was 15ppg, 42% overall, 33% three point and 3.8apg. So you can see that Dinkins offensive stats are very similar to our two best offensive guards from last season. Defensively he is more similar to Grant than Jimmy, but Jimmy was a freak of nature defensively.
I see our backcourt of Dinkins, Edwards, DiMichelle, Rozier, Williams, Crawford and throw in Necas, Corbett and Hronsky as being very solid. We will see who is right Evan Myia or my lying eyes.
Tre Dinkins 2023-24 Stats per Game - NCAAM - ESPN
Re: Projected 2024-25 roster with comparative stats
Re: Projected 2024-25 roster with comparative stats
CLK wrote: