Welcome to SHOO-SHOO, RAH-RAH! The Duquesne Dukes Basketball Fan Message Board!
One of America's Great Message Boards - Any Inappropriate Posts Will Be Deleted!

duke-passing



Current Men's Basketball Roster and Coaches are now up:
Just type in Duquesne University Men's Basketball - Great Read on Everyone!
Go Dukes!

You are not logged in. Would you like to login or register?



1/27/2022 9:56 pm  #1


Which personalities influenced the basketball disaster at Duquesne?

I nominate Red Manning for failing to get Duquesne in Big East and scaring off Gary Williams to be our coach in 1982.
Lots more and I am hoping to give credit where credit is due.Maybe others could recall stories of the buffoonery
that enriches the total disaster  of  Duquesne University basketball.

 

1/27/2022 10:04 pm  #2


Re: Which personalities influenced the basketball disaster at Duquesne?

Stew, you are correct about Manning not wanting Gary Williams. Also, I’m sure glad you don’t hold a grudge!

 

1/27/2022 10:07 pm  #3


Re: Which personalities influenced the basketball disaster at Duquesne?

Sean Hogan?He always seemed to garner the gnashing of teeth among Dukes fans.

     Thread Starter
 

1/27/2022 10:13 pm  #4


Re: Which personalities influenced the basketball disaster at Duquesne?

Millions and millions of dollars that came Pitts way that Duquesne should have had.Yea that one stings really 
hard on the rump.Lets not join a league where most members were small Catholic institutions and follow
big state schools that always whined about being in a league with Duquesne.

     Thread Starter
 

1/27/2022 10:19 pm  #5


Re: Which personalities influenced the basketball disaster at Duquesne?

The pride of Homestead pa. John Manning.Fine basketball coach,louzy administrator.Thanks red head.

     Thread Starter
 

1/27/2022 10:31 pm  #6


Re: Which personalities influenced the basketball disaster at Duquesne?

Brian Colleary.He started the rich tradition of hosting NCAA tournament games in Pittsburgh and always had the Duquesne logo on the Civic Arena floor giving Duquesne that much needed Tv exposure.He was always
under the idea that fans would chirp all day seeing the Duquesne logo and be mesermerized.He was enormously excited by Duquesne womens athletics.A real trailblaizer with womens athletics.

     Thread Starter
 

1/27/2022 10:39 pm  #7


Re: Which personalities influenced the basketball disaster at Duquesne?

Dont be shy fellars,it took a lot of well known Duquesne personalities who contributed and I just want to
call them out.

     Thread Starter
 

1/27/2022 10:52 pm  #8


Re: Which personalities influenced the basketball disaster at Duquesne?

The greatest president of all times Donald the Duck! Hooray!!!!!!!!!!

     Thread Starter
 

1/28/2022 9:31 am  #9


Re: Which personalities influenced the basketball disaster at Duquesne?

What would really be interesting to this post, is if we could get all the former coaches to answer this question . Starting with Mike Rice up to Jim Ferry. Would love to see their answers as to why our basketball program is in the state it is and their recommendations.

 

1/28/2022 10:05 am  #10


Re: Which personalities influenced the basketball disaster at Duquesne?

You may need to dig deeper and go back to allowing a great coach Dudley Moore leave a highly successful Duquesne program in a parallel move to LaSalle because Duquesne refused to pay him a decent salary!  When Duquesne sat at the highest tier of Collge basketball they still didn’t have the vision to invest and continue to keep the program on top!  They could have paid Dudey and had continued success; built an on-campus facility for basketball and never missed a beat!

 

1/28/2022 10:10 am  #11


Re: Which personalities influenced the basketball disaster at Duquesne?

Wildwood13 wrote:

What would really be interesting to this post, is if we could get all the former coaches to answer this question . Starting with Mike Rice up to Jim Ferry. Would love to see their answers as to why our basketball program is in the state it is and their recommendations.

CLK get on that👍How about Duquesne filing a lawsuit for breach of contract against Ferry. At least the Universuty could set forth a legal precedent for future coaches😂

 

1/28/2022 10:28 am  #12


Re: Which personalities influenced the basketball disaster at Duquesne?

Also, do we know for a fact that Duquesne was offered an opportunity to join the original Big East lineup? Duquesne definitely deserved to be among the original invitees based on their fan support, successful history and as the primary basketball program in the region. Certainly adding Seton Hall was kind of a favor to some old cronies; because they were not even on the map at that time; but remember that Dave Gavitt’s goal was to disrupt the Eastern All-Sports Conference that Joe Paterno was developing to encompass all football playing schools in the east, but to include all sports! So Gavitt needed to include Syracuse and Pitt to disrupt the Eastern All-Sports Conference. The story at the time was that that was why a basketball nobody like Pitt was included!

Last edited by levon1975 (1/28/2022 5:44 pm)

 

1/28/2022 10:57 am  #13


Re: Which personalities influenced the basketball disaster at Duquesne?

Dudey Moore started it by going to La Salle.

 

1/28/2022 11:22 am  #14


Re: Which personalities influenced the basketball disaster at Duquesne?

The reasons why it started were before my time.   What saddens me today is that we put a silk hat on a pig with the fieldhouse, and some at DU think its going to change into a race horse.   The lack of institutional care or concern is also alarming.   I consider DU to be an expensive school, and yet so many things seem to be ran cheaply.   Now, I've seen more DU fund raising campaign posts in the last 5 days than I have seen from athletic teams over the last 5 years, just from a social media aspect.   Just shows what matters most(C.R.E.A.M.).    DU doesnt care to be known for any athletic teams, sadly.   And thats not a bad thing, education/buildings/labs/professors are what college is about.   Just nothing to really cheer about, or brag about to your friends from pitt or psu.    Thats just my take.   I would go on, but probably get in trouble   :-)

If DU was asked to join to original Big East, and turned that down, that would probably be the point where DU bball jumped the shark.

Last edited by townsonkid (1/28/2022 11:25 am)

 

1/28/2022 11:36 am  #15


Re: Which personalities influenced the basketball disaster at Duquesne?

levon1975 wrote:

Also, do we know for a fact that Duquesne was offered an opportunity to join the original Big East lineup? Duquesne definitely deserved to be among the original invitees base on their fan support, successful history and as the primary basketball program in the region. Certainly adding Seton Hall was kind of a favor to some old cronies; because they were not even on the map at that time; but remember that Dave Gavitt’s goal was to disrupt the Eastern All-Sports Conference that Joe Paterno was developing to encompass all football playing schools in the east, but to include all sports! So Gavitt needed to include Syracuse and Pitt to disrupt the Eastern All-Sports Conference. The story at the time was that that was why a basketball nobody like Pitt was included!

Duquesne was not invited as one of the original members of the Big East, or have they ever been invited to join. Holy Cross and Rutgers were the only original invited teams that rejected the Big East.

 

1/28/2022 2:22 pm  #16


Re: Which personalities influenced the basketball disaster at Duquesne?

Nesti drilled the hole and Murray and Dougherty bolted it shut. 

I think the absolute neglect by these three of the program have killed it.   I’m 61.  I never thought I would be waiting since 1977 for success.   With the transfer portal and NIL, this program is dead.   

I stopped watching or listening.   I just check the score before I go to bed.

 

1/28/2022 5:11 pm  #17


Re: Which personalities influenced the basketball disaster at Duquesne?

A83 wrote:

Nesti drilled the hole and Murray and Dougherty bolted it shut.

I think the absolute neglect by these three of the program have killed it. I’m 61. I never thought I would be waiting since 1977 for success. With the transfer portal and NIL, this program is dead.

I stopped watching or listening. I just check the score before I go to bed.

With your prediction of 6 wins, your opinion should be respected because right now you look like the smartest person in the room.

However, I think the limitations are more systemic than individual. We have never put a lot of money in the program. We suspended the basketball program in WWII (N.B.: Pitt did not, just played fewer games) and Chick Davies had to teach and coach at Homestead HS to make a living then. Dudey Moore made a lateral move to LaSalle. Red Manning was paid peanuts. I have heard it said we neglected basketball to beef up the endowment in the '80s and '90s.. We got Mr. Palumbo to donate so we had an on-campus facility but had to cut corners to stay within budget.. We made Darelle Porter head coach; I assume he wasn't paid much either. We tried to low-ball the head coach's salary and got JF. We cobbled together money from various sources and have the Coop--nice-looking but small. Now I'm hearing that the new financial emphasis is on the osteopathic school.

I understand that before Pitt became state-related, Duquesne tried to keep tuition down for a private school so perhaps we never had the money to stay successful. Certainly we never had Duke tobacco money that helps pay Coach K this very day. I agree with many on this board that because Western Pennsylvania and Eastern Ohio had good high school players supplemented by a sprinkling of outsiders (e.g., Sihugo Green, Jim Tucker), we could disguise these shortcomings. When the money in college basketball got big, we couldn't keep up.

I'm still glad I went to Duquesne but I sure would like that NCAA bid before I die.

 

1/28/2022 5:46 pm  #18


Re: Which personalities influenced the basketball disaster at Duquesne?

Bilgy wrote:

Dudey Moore started it by going to La Salle.

Right, that's what I posted above; basically over money.  Duquesne had this great program and never realized what a gem it had, and just frittered it away by being too cheap to invest in keeping a great coach! 

 

1/28/2022 6:06 pm  #19


Re: Which personalities influenced the basketball disaster at Duquesne?

scduke wrote:

A83 wrote:

Nesti drilled the hole and Murray and Dougherty bolted it shut.

I think the absolute neglect by these three of the program have killed it. I’m 61. I never thought I would be waiting since 1977 for success. With the transfer portal and NIL, this program is dead.

I stopped watching or listening. I just check the score before I go to bed.

With your prediction of 6 wins, your opinion should be respected because right now you look like the smartest person in the room.

However, I think the limitations are more systemic than individual. We have never put a lot of money in the program. We suspended the basketball program in WWII (N.B.: Pitt did not, just played fewer games) and Chick Davies had to teach and coach at Homestead HS to make a living then. Dudey Moore made a lateral move to LaSalle. Red Manning was paid peanuts. I have heard it said we neglected basketball to beef up the endowment in the '80s and '90s.. We got Mr. Palumbo to donate so we had an on-campus facility but had to cut corners to stay within budget.. We made Darelle Porter head coach; I assume he wasn't paid much either. We tried to low-ball the head coach's salary and got JF. We cobbled together money from various sources and have the Coop--nice-looking but small. Now I'm hearing that the new financial emphasis is on the osteopathic school.

I understand that before Pitt became state-related, Duquesne tried to keep tuition down for a private school so perhaps we never had the money to stay successful. Certainly we never had Duke tobacco money that helps pay Coach K this very day. I agree with many on this board that because Western Pennsylvania and Eastern Ohio had good high school players supplemented by a sprinkling of outsiders (e.g., Sihugo Green, Jim Tucker), we could disguise these shortcomings. When the money in college basketball got big, we couldn't keep up.

I'm still glad I went to Duquesne but I sure would like that NCAA bid before I die.

Amen, well said!  I'm in the same situation; just hoping for some kind of miracle; perhaps selling our souls to the devil like the great bluesman Robert Johnson allegedly did to become a great blues guitarist.  In our case it would be in exchange for one good team!  Of course those things only happen in fiction, so I've become resigned to the reality that it's never happening.  At some point an adult has to make the decision to stop the embarrassment and pull the plug; and either get out of the game; or at least drop down to a league that is commensurate with Duquesne's commitment. Hire the best X's and O's guy you can afford, and recruit guys who understand how to play basketball, and just want the chance to play at a D-1 school, and I'll support the team.     
 

Last edited by levon1975 (1/28/2022 6:14 pm)

 

1/28/2022 6:25 pm  #20


Re: Which personalities influenced the basketball disaster at Duquesne?

While I'm at it, let me also say that I'm really tired of these coaches smelling the desperation in the air when negotiating contracts with Duquesne.  They realize the situation and know that like many previous coaches they don't ever actually intend on winning. They just buy themselves some time with a five-year plan that never delivers a winner; then walk away set up for retirement on the generous Duquesne salary.  Let's pay a coach a fair salary for two years then load the deal with incentives based on him actually winning a certain number of games, finishing in the top three in the league, and getting to the NIT or NCAA.  If he delivers, reward him with generous incentive raises.   

 

1/28/2022 9:01 pm  #21


Re: Which personalities influenced the basketball disaster at Duquesne?

STEW: I am sincere when I say this. I watched you do cheers with the students at the one game. They responded to you 100%. The Dukes need a spark. If you are going to the game tomorrow why not talk to the students before the game and explain a few cheers. I think you would be a success. If you get the students going who knows…

 

1/29/2022 8:44 am  #22


Re: Which personalities influenced the basketball disaster at Duquesne?

A83 to your point Dougherty NEVER attended one A-10 executive meeting. The Dukes were never invited to the Big East since they wouldn’t have been able to meet the minimum spend on the athletic budget, yet alone men’s basketball. Prior to KD every coach has dealt with incredible disadvantages and whatever success was accomplished was a near miracle!
In light of past events KD has been given dam near whatever he has asked for. Remember one of the big selling points in getting KD to come was the fact that the A-10 was regularly a multi bid league and the MAC wasn’t. Several times KD had teams with good records that settled for the NIT or nothing. Those frustrations and all of Harper’s vision sold the deal. KD had been approached in the past.
2017 (27-9) 2016 (26-9) 2007 (26-7)

Last edited by The Dome (1/29/2022 8:47 am)

 

1/29/2022 10:35 am  #23


Re: Which personalities influenced the basketball disaster at Duquesne?

I have followed the team since the Willie Somerset years.   The following are my views. When Red Manning retired and became AD, he wanted to make sure his legacy was intact. He undermined Cinacola and was so hated by Gavitt and others forming the league that we did not get a Big East invite. Presidents who didn’t care (Nesti, Murray, Daugherty) hurt the ability to be functional. Nesti met with fundraisers, asked for 20K, was promised 200K and then spent the rest of the meeting talking about the Music School! Murray insisted on hiring Nee when Colleary wanted Bruiser Flint. Daugherty was amazed when we had a crowd of 10,000 for a Xavier game. The Vice President of Student Life (Hogan) killed the program by restraining the budget and making sure the ADs listened to him. ADs who thought more of themselves (Colleary/Amodio) than the program. Coaches who were terrible with recruiting. Little wonder we have been in the desert.

I like what Gormley, Harper and Dambrot have started. Gormley gets it and leads. Harper has sprouted a program, now can he grow it? Coach Dambrot is the right guy, but is he worn down? Can we step up our recruiting and get into the fight?

The past tells us that we can’t be half-measure. If the goal is to win championships, then attack it with everything we have! Go Dukes!

 

1/29/2022 10:44 am  #24


Re: Which personalities influenced the basketball disaster at Duquesne?

I'm with you HookShot. I think Gormley, Harper, and KD come off looking pretty good in these walks down memory lane. I'm not happy that what was progress has now stalled, but I will never give up hope.

 

1/29/2022 1:09 pm  #25


Re: Which personalities influenced the basketball disaster at Duquesne?

I graduated in ‘90.
Nesti was president my first 2 years.

My history is fuzzy but I remember the University endowment at pitiful levels.  Nesti leaves & Murray enters.
Murray drove incredible fundraising & shored up the budgets
Limited focus on sports.
Title IX started about that time & killed a bunch of mens sports.

Can’t remember who funded AJP.  Opened for the 88-89 season
Was it led by Nesti?  Or by coincidence while Nesti was in charge?

Last edited by Box & One (1/29/2022 1:10 pm)

 

Board footera

 

Powered by Boardhost. Create a Free Forum